Lily Zheng Explores Why DEI Efforts Often Fall Short and How to Fix Them

DEI efforts are at a crossroads. New federal policies ban diversity, equity and inclusion programs within the government and among its contractors. Many companies are pulling back their DEI initiatives, hoping to avoid lawsuits and media controversy. At the same time, the systemic inequities that inspired the growth of DEI policies still persist.  

Author and DEI strategist Lily Zheng recently spoke with Jackie Ferguson, Vice President of Content, Products and Programming at The Diversity Movement, about creating real, lasting change in the workplace. Zheng's work has been featured in Harvard Business Review, New York Times, and NPR. Their groundbreaking books— “DEI Deconstructed,” “Reconstructing DEI,” and “Fixing Fairness”—lay out practical, evidence-based strategies for building inclusive and effective organizations.  

During their conversation, Zheng and Ferguson discussed what it will take to create real, measurable change in workplaces.  

Jackie: What inspired you to pursue a career focused on creating change? 

Lily: Like many in this field, my motivation came from personal experience. As a second-generation Chinese American, and as a queer and trans person, I’ve encountered exclusion and inequity firsthand. These experiences led me to study social psychology and organizational sociology, where I realized that we already know a lot about how to reduce bias and create better systems. However, there's a gap between knowledge and action. My work is about bridging that gap—taking what we know works and implementing it effectively to create workplaces that support everyone.

Jackie: Your book "DEI Deconstructed" offers a guide for systemic change. How does your approach differ from traditional DEI strategies? 

Lily: I wrote this book as both a love letter and a wake-up call to the DEI industry. The work is morally imperative and widely supported, yet traditional DEI efforts often fall short. Companies claim to be committed but rely on ineffective initiatives—like occasional cultural celebrations or voluntary lunch-and-learns—without addressing systemic issues. Discrimination rates, particularly for Black Americans, have remained stagnant for decades, despite these efforts. We need to focus on measurable outcomes, not just good intentions. Studies show that even simple changes, like standardized hiring rubrics, dramatically reduce bias. If we’re serious about DEI, we must move beyond surface-level commitments and implement evidence-based strategies that actually work. 

The Four Pillars of the FAIR Framework: Fairness, Access, Inclusion, and Representation 

Jackie: Can you explain how your FAIR framework—Fairness, Access, Inclusion, and Representation—improves DEI efforts? 

Lily: FAIR reimagines DEI work to be more effective and defensible, especially in today’s climate. It emphasizes four key elements: 

• Fairness: Ensuring processes and policies are just and transparent. 
• Access: Removing barriers so all employees have equal opportunities. 
• Inclusion: Creating environments where diverse perspectives are valued. 
• Representation: Ensuring leadership and decision-making bodies reflect diversity. 

These pillars are supported by four principles: outcomes, systems, coalitions, and win-win. Measuring impact (outcomes), addressing root causes (systems), building broad support (coalitions), and framing DEI as beneficial for all (win-win) create sustainable change. When organizations focus on these, they see real progress rather than performative gestures.

How Measuring Impact Can Improve DEI Efforts and Keep Practitioners Motivated 

Jackie: How can organizations maintain accountability for DEI commitments? 

Lily: The biggest challenge in DEI is the lack of measurement. In 2020, companies pledged billions to racial justice initiatives, but much of that money has disappeared without impact. Organizations need to track results, not just activities. 

I often ask companies: “Have you reduced discrimination? Have employees’ experiences improved?” Too often, their answer is, “Well, we did an unconscious bias training.” But if they didn’t measure its effectiveness, how do they know it worked? Other fields, like marketing, rigorously track success. DEI must do the same. If we aren’t holding ourselves accountable, how can we expect real progress?

Strategies for Navigating Today’s Societal DEI Challenges 

Jackie: Many companies are scaling back DEI efforts due to economic pressures and criticism. How should leaders advocate for DEI in this climate? 

Lily: First, let’s clarify the situation. While media narratives suggest widespread retreat, data tells a different story: 12% of companies are scaling back, 65% are holding steady, and 22% are increasing investment. The real issue isn’t mass abandonment—it’s that companies are getting quieter due to political risks. Meanwhile, public support for DEI has declined to 52%. This shift is fueled by misinformation, like claims that DEI mandates quotas (which are illegal) or gives jobs to unqualified people (which is false). Leaders must counter these narratives with facts. DEI is about eliminating barriers, not preferential treatment. The opposite of DEI isn’t meritocracy—it’s discrimination. To maintain momentum, organizations must clearly articulate how DEI benefits everyone and focus on measurable impact. 

Jackie: How can companies effectively communicate the win-win of DEI? 

Lily: Everyone wants to know, “What’s in it for me?” If DEI is framed as only benefiting marginalized groups, it fuels resistance. But when we highlight universal benefits—fairer hiring, better workplace culture, stronger teams—people engage more positively. Take parental leave policies; they’re often framed as benefiting women, but men also want more time with their families. When we broaden the conversation to include them, we build coalitions and stronger support for change. Until White men in the workplace can say, “DEI has improved my experience, too,” we’ll continue facing backlash. The key is showing that DEI isn’t about taking away—it’s about making workplaces better for everyone.

For more advice from Lily Zheng, listen to the full episode of the Diversity: Beyond the Checkbox podcast, “DEI Under Fire: Why the Old Playbook No Longer Works.”